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Post by dancingmjsdream on Aug 21, 2017 16:41:01 GMT
I agree. It would have been the dumbest thing ever to make an album with songs like D.S,Scream, Tabloid Junkie, They don't care about us which could piss of the press if he was guilty.Why would somebody want all that negative attention?
Truth is, MJ didn't care. And I respect him so much for that. He could have made some carefree music and forget all of it but he needed to say what he felt.
I have always loved angry MJ, songs like Morphine,D.S , Tabloid Junkie and TDCAU are among my favourites.
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Post by Russg on Aug 22, 2017 7:15:10 GMT
It's interesting though, I assume y'all didn't really have all the facts etc. Back then, was it all trust? Well, the GQ magazine article Was Michael Jackson Framed? was published before the HIStory album was released. Plus, there were the secret phone recordings of Evan Chandler saying how Jordy was irrelevant to him and how he was going to destroy everyone in sight. It doesn't take Einstein to smell a rat when you hear stuff like that.
I still think the public had a certain degree of goodwill towards MJ after 1993. It was the press who were relentless.
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Post by dancingmjsdream on Aug 22, 2017 7:26:24 GMT
I think the settlement put off many people/fans... but the media definitely did their best to turn the public against him.
I was more or less talking about the time were there weren't many facts avaible (like short after Evan Chandler made the allegations public ) but fans stood still by his side. I can only imagine how shocking it must have been to hear these things about MJ. Of course, when time has passed, it became obvious what it all was about.
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,413
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Post by TonyR on Aug 22, 2017 7:52:54 GMT
I have always maintained that it wasn't the allegations that put many people off MJ, it was the surgery & skin colour.
Then it was a downward spiral as the appearance & alleged bizarre behaviour made the allegations much easier to believe (if you're a superficial person who isn't too bothered about facts i.e. the mainstream press and most people).
That's why, like I put in the Bad 30 thread Respect posted, I wish he would have told people about the vitiligo much earlier & also why I wish he'd have had less surgery (a totally separate thread!!).
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2017 9:35:19 GMT
Straight into the serious stuff here.
Yeah, his skin and appearance was a way bigger issue. This was an issue from before the crap that started, and the jokes about him being "plastic" were the only ones I ever heard at school.
That being said, when you could ignore the morons, this era was a wonderful period to be alive for
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milo
Wondering Who
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Post by milo on Aug 22, 2017 21:00:29 GMT
I wish I was old enough to fully experience this era.
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Post by dancingmjsdream on Aug 22, 2017 21:03:51 GMT
I wish I was old enough to fully experience this era. Born in 1998, I feel ya.
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,413
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Post by TonyR on Aug 22, 2017 21:16:22 GMT
I wish I was old enough to fully experience this era. Born in 1998, I feel ya. Blimey. I feel old!!
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Post by aazzaabb on Aug 22, 2017 21:49:08 GMT
Ah come on man! 68 isn't old anymore! It's the new 58!
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Post by HIStoric on Aug 22, 2017 22:41:45 GMT
I don't think may teens now for example would say they were a fan of Ed Sheeran or Adele? I may be wrong. They definitely would, especially with Ed Sheeran
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Post by dancingmjsdream on Aug 23, 2017 5:08:59 GMT
Hm I think people wouldn't say they like Justin Bieber, One Direction etc. I think they are very famous and definitely not cool to like lol
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Post by HIStoric on Aug 23, 2017 7:10:25 GMT
Hm I think people wouldn't say they like Justin Bieber, One Direction etc. I think they are very famous and definitely not cool to like lol Nah Biebers still very popular. Dude's been #1 on the US Charts for (literally) the last 14 weeks or something. I think many people (not you) still think Bieber's fanbase is made up of pre-teen girls but his fanbase matured a few years ago, mainly in 2015 when he started releasing music that was of a more mature style than what he previously put out. I think before 2015, it wasn't as popular to admit you liked Bieber, but since then at least among older teens/young adults of both sexes, it's pretty easy to find someone who admits to liking some of Bieber's music. Certainly not a big deal or anything. As with 1D, not so much. 1D as a group never really transitioned beyond their pre-teen fanbase and they broke up before that could really happen, so you still see a lot of predominantly young girls going crazy for them. As solo artists, mainly ZAYN and Styles, they seem to be starting to mature their image a bit and are certainly cooler to like than they used to be. Bieber's been much more proactive than them so if they keep it up, they'll probably be more 'acceptable' to like like the Biebs.
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Post by dancingmjsdream on Aug 23, 2017 10:32:53 GMT
Hm I think people wouldn't say they like Justin Bieber, One Direction etc. I think they are very famous and definitely not cool to like lol Nah Biebers still very popular. Dude's been #1 on the US Charts for (literally) the last 14 weeks or something. I think many people (not you) still think Bieber's fanbase is made up of pre-teen girls but his fanbase matured a few years ago, mainly in 2015 when he started releasing music that was of a more mature style than what he previously put out. I think before 2015, it wasn't as popular to admit you liked Bieber, but since then at least among older teens/young adults of both sexes, it's pretty easy to find someone who admits to liking some of Bieber's music. Certainly not a big deal or anything. As with 1D, not so much. 1D as a group never really transitioned beyond their pre-teen fanbase and they broke up before that could really happen, so you still see a lot of predominantly young girls going crazy for them. As solo artists, mainly ZAYN and Styles, they seem to be starting to mature their image a bit and are certainly cooler to like than they used to be. Bieber's been much more proactive than them so if they keep it up, they'll probably be more 'acceptable' to like like the Biebs. You may be right, but (at least in my school) it is still not considered 'cool' to be a Justin Bieber fan. To like some of his songs is totally fine, but nobody would be jealous if I waved around JB concert tickets lol
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,413
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Post by TonyR on Aug 23, 2017 13:09:49 GMT
In all fairness I can see why it wasn't cool to be an MJ fan in the mid-late 90s.
1. He'd been the biggest star it's possible to be for ten years & people like to think they are different & don't follow the crowd. 2. He was nearly 40 by then and teens/young people identify with pop stars around their own age. 3. The persona of MJ. Say what you like but his changing appearance made him 'less cool' 4. Obviously you can't ignore the allegations & constant association of kids with his name
It also wasn't/isn't cool to like Madonna or Prince then, even though Madonna was still having big hits then (although until Ray Of Light rejuvinated her in 1997 it was on a much lesser scale).
Anyway, the point is that it wasn't just MJ who suffered from 'lack of cool', but he just had a much bigger fall from grace and the allegations mutliplied it massively for him.
Like I've said, the ironic thing is that it didn't really affect his commerciality that much outside of the UK as per examples in the first post. Yes, HIStory sold nowhere near previous works but by 1995 records weren't selling as much anyway plus it was a double disc at a very high price.
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Post by Snow White on Aug 23, 2017 19:03:44 GMT
People can say all the excuses they want why being an MJ fan was seen negatively but the truth is that people in general are unkind, cruel and judgemental to what it's different and they don't understand. I've never been famous by any means but I experienced such treatment in my childhood and adolescence for being the only classmate with a walker, having also nasty looks on the street too.
Fans could say that the Thriller and Bad years were the most magical ones to be an MJ fan but so was Dangerous and HIStory. Before Dangerous, it was a bad thing to listen to music in English in some Spanish speaking countries but Black Or White was so apealing to the radio stations that it changed that and Michael including those places in the Dangerous Tour, it increased the Michaelmania despite the allegations.
Even though the media and people criticized Michael's appearence and his private life a lot and his fans were chastised if you liked him or defended him )it never ashamed me to say he was my no. 1 favorite singer every time I was asked despite being ridiculed though,) MIchael was everywhere. Mexico premiered the HIStory Teaser, Scream, they broadcasted the prime time interview with Diane Sawyer. Scream and YANA were played on the radio a lot too, even some of his previous short films were played on the weekends and Moonwalker as well.
Probably fans in Europe experienced the HIStory success more intensively since the record was received with open arms compared to USA but I'm glad I was old enough to experience and remember the HIStory era, that his art as a whole was a solace for my crappy childhood. It warms my heart remembering how excited I was tuning the radio to listen BOTDF and Ghost, the first time I slept in the early morning at 2am to record the HIStory Munich concert (I also slept at midnight to record Ghosts and the making of,) I couldnโt care less if it was lip synched, at the time I didn't notice and was mesmerized by his magical presence, his voice and dance moves. So Michael Jackson from the HIStory era will be my Michael as well.
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