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Post by respect77 on Jul 5, 2019 9:39:11 GMT
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Post by respect77 on Jul 5, 2019 10:14:42 GMT
Looking up the organizations in opposition of the new California bill. The American Tort Reform Association (http://www.atra.org/about/mission/ ) telling it like it is! This is EXACTLY what Finaldi, Robson and Safechuck are doing with Leaving Neverland!
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,469
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Post by TonyR on Jul 5, 2019 10:49:17 GMT
Problem with the French fans' lawsuit is that they have made the news on BBC therefore bringing LN back into people's consciousness.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 5, 2019 10:50:20 GMT
Problem with the French fans' lawsuit is that they have made the news on BBC therefore bringing LN back into people's consciousness. Snap Ireland. But it hardly made any impact here anyway. Life moved on.
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Post by Thriller on Jul 5, 2019 23:34:04 GMT
I think this is an excellent point.
It reminds me of seeing people refer to the pair as 'boys' when they're men to excuse inconsistencies. Reed said something along the lines of 'he was 10, you can't expect him to remember a location' when Safechuck claimed he was abused at the Grammys. Except, Safechuck was 35 when he made the claim. He also didn't just get a location wrong.
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Post by amaya on Jul 5, 2019 23:46:31 GMT
I think this is an excellent point. It reminds me of seeing people refer to the pair as 'boys' when they're men to excuse inconsistencies. Reed said something along the lines of 'he was 10, you can't expect him to remember a location' when Safechuck claimed he was abused at the Grammys. Except, Safechuck was 35 when he made the claim. He also didn't just get a location wrong. I've noticed this as well. Whenever the alleged victim is male, especially with MJ, people are so quick to play up the sweet innocent angle, using "cutesy" nicknames and pearl-clutching and screaming about "THE POOR BABY BOOOYYYYYSSSSS". Imagine if the accusers were women. Would this whole ordeal have gotten so far?
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Post by Vega on Jul 6, 2019 8:38:40 GMT
I think this is an excellent point. It reminds me of seeing people refer to the pair as 'boys' when they're men to excuse inconsistencies. Reed said something along the lines of 'he was 10, you can't expect him to remember a location' when Safechuck claimed he was abused at the Grammys. Except, Safechuck was 35 when he made the claim. He also didn't just get a location wrong. I've noticed this as well. Whenever the alleged victim is male, especially with MJ, people are so quick to play up the sweet innocent angle, using "cutesy" nicknames and pearl-clutching and screaming about "THE POOR BABY BOOOYYYYYSSSSS". Imagine if the accusers were women. Would this whole ordeal have gotten so far? Probably? I dunno, if Michael had the same friendships with young girls instead of boys it probably would have looked worse and would have gotten more attention even without accusations. I mean, the R. Kelly accusers had some weird factual issues as well. The whole claim that the one woman made about YANA being written after she miscarried was total bullshit - she didn't know Kelly until years after it was written and released. Not to say he isn't guilty (there's videographic evidence ffs), but the media didn't give a shit about that glaring lie.
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Post by respect77 on Jul 6, 2019 9:43:57 GMT
I think exactly R. Kelly's case shows that male accusers had less problems to be believed than female accusers in the past. Maybe not any more, due to MeToo, but I remember that back in 2004-2005 when both MJ and R. Kelly were on trial there absolutely was a double standard in how they were treated in the media. Kelly was treated more leniently, simply because the abuse of girls wasn't considered as bad as the alleged abuse of boys (IMO there is an underlying homophobia behind the differing sentiment).
Nelson George (the same journalist who after MJ's death pretended to be a fan again and was put on the Bad 25 documentary) at the time even wrote an article about why people treat MJ and R. Kelly differently. While I didn't find George's original article from 2005, I found this summary of it - also from 2005, and with additional quotes from also others making excuses for Kelly in a "*wink, wink*, what man didn't have fantasies of having sex with a young girl?" way. Disgusting.
articles.chicagotribune.com/2005-07-24/news/0507240199_1_kelly-cultural-crossover-elephant-man
There was a HUGE difference in how the allegations against Kelly and MJ were treated by the media at the time. As there is still a huge difference in how people look at the allegations against MJ and Iggy Pop or the Rollong Stones singing about having sex with underage girls, or Elvis dating a 14 yo Priscilla.
There has also been a difference in sentiment if the alleged abuser was a female and she was abusing a boy as even South Park once pointed out that hypocrisy. So that points to homophobia really being behind the different sentiment between when the accuser and the accused are of the same sex or when they are of different sex.
Of course, with MeToo and all now maybe sentiments are changing and maybe that's why these allegations have caught up with Kelly now, while in 2005 they were treated more leniently.
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Jul 6, 2019 14:18:30 GMT
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Post by elusivemoonwalker on Jul 6, 2019 17:18:10 GMT
Doubt it
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Post by amaya on Jul 6, 2019 18:32:35 GMT
I think exactly R. Kelly's case shows that male accusers had less problems to be believed than female accusers in the past. Maybe not any more, due to MeToo, but I remember that back in 2004-2005 when both MJ and R. Kelly were on trial there absolutely was a double standard in how they were treated in the media. Kelly was treated more leniently, simply because the abuse of girls wasn't considered as bad as the alleged abuse of boys (IMO there is an underlying homophobia behind the differing sentiment). Nelson George (the same journalist who after MJ's death pretended to be a fan again and was put on the Bad 25 documentary) at the time even wrote an article about why people treat MJ and R. Kelly differently. While I didn't find George's original article from 2005, I found this summary of it - also from 2005, and with additional quotes from also others making excuses for Kelly in a "*wink, wink*, what man didn't have fantasies of having sex with a young girl?" way. Disgusting.
There was a HUGE difference in how the allegations against Kelly and MJ were treated by the media at the time. As there is still a huge difference in how people look at the allegations against MJ and Iggy Pop or the Rollong Stones singing about having sex with underage girls, or Elvis dating a 14 yo Priscilla.
There has also been a difference in sentiment if the alleged abuser was a female and she was abusing a boy as even South Park once pointed out that hypocrisy. So that points to homophobia really being behind the different sentiment between when the accuser and the accused are of the same sex or when they are of different sex.
Of course, with MeToo and all now maybe sentiments are changing and maybe that's why these allegations have caught up with Kelly now, while in 2005 they were treated more leniently.
This is exactly what I was talking about. It's very different if the accuser is female, though like you said MeToo has probably changed that. Even the Jane Doe that was briefly involved in all of this was ignored by the MJFacts crowd and other haters.
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Post by Snow White on Jul 6, 2019 22:47:22 GMT
Bill Bottrell's daughter.
I was reading her fb post and it's kind of disrespectful she implied Michael was sexually abused. He never said that publicly and if he was, he confided it privately. That's why it's disrespectful to divulge it.
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Jul 7, 2019 0:35:12 GMT
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Post by pg13 on Jul 7, 2019 9:10:30 GMT
I think Wade was 12 or 13 at the time and MJJ Productions put this album out as Michael signed Quo. Unlikely MJ didn't know of the liner notes being President of MJJP. At any rate, this is MJ Cast who also strenuously denied that Wade was the boy in the I'll Be There Pepsi commercial. They got embarrassed on that one. They do like to tell half a story. Still, this doesn't really help the cause and it's better to directly deal with their allegations which has largely been done quite well.
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Jul 8, 2019 1:09:26 GMT
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