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Post by pg13 on Oct 11, 2020 11:59:24 GMT
Lou Ferrigno hadn't even seen MJ for three weeks before he died and his account is essentially rubbish. Ate once a day? Really? Kai Chase states otherwise - Michael had breakfast, lunch and dinner. Lunch and dinner was spent with his kids. Murray was an occasional dinner guest of theirs. Here: www.theguardian.com/music/2009/jul/30/michael-jackson-chef-interviewAs such, we can comfortably disregard Lou Ferrigno without further consideration. Why would we automatically disregard anything he has to say, just because you found interviews with the chef? Considering he was his trainer, I actually want to read more into what he had to say about his routines towards the end. Three weeks wasn't three years. There's no need to be so dismissive by the way, we are only discussing here. Why wouldn't we? Lou's account doesn't fit the available evidence and that's all that really matters - evidence. To be clear, it's Lou's comment about MJ eating ONCE a day that's being dismissed. Not any training regimen.Autopsy report - not skeletal or emaciated, but a fairly healthy 50 year old man with a robust heart. Zero evidence of anorexia in that. Expert witness - Dr Shafer already provided. Kenny Ortega provided also - issues more psychological than physical which chimes with the autopsy report. And so on. Discussion is one thing, but repeating debunked claims is quite another. In this case, available evidence is all that matters. Speculation is largely irrelevant as are personal feelings about Michael Jackson’s health. That's the reality. |
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Post by pg13 on Oct 11, 2020 12:01:08 GMT
Why would we automatically disregard anything he has to say, just because you found interviews with the chef? Considering he was his trainer, I actually want to read more into what he had to say about his routines towards the end. Three weeks wasn't three years. There's no need to be so dismissive by the way, we are only discussing here. I wouldn’t take it personally. PG13 has always had an intrinsic need to be right in everything he posts haha. It isn't even me. But the evidence has always been there disproving various claims. That's the point, isn't it? Claims should always be thrown away once evidence disproves them. |
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Post by aazzaabb on Oct 11, 2020 12:08:39 GMT
I wouldn’t take it personally. PG13 has always had an intrinsic need to be right in everything he posts haha. But the evidence has always been there disproving various claims. That's the point, isn't it? Claims should always be thrown away once evidence disproves them. Oh it’s definitely you. You’ve always had to be the authoritative final word on pretty much anything MJ related haven’t you? As you mentioned, Charles, MJCast.... Fans are having a conversation here regarding MJ’s health. Are we supposed to just end the conversation and go home because you post the facts? Essentially you try to shut down the conversation or try to come across as some sort of ultimate authority. People have a need to express themselves without always being jumped on and gaslighted. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 12:09:16 GMT
I wouldn’t take it personally. PG13 has always had an intrinsic need to be right in everything he posts haha. It isn't even me. But the evidence has always been there disproving various claims. That's the point, isn't it? Claims should always be thrown away once evidence disproves them. It's a quote from 1 interview. Why wouldn't anyone want to know more about what kind of fitness plan or nutrition MJ was on in the weeks/months prior to his death? MJs issues didnt just start in his last 3 weeks. Its just bizarre to say we can completely disregard everything the guy says because it contradicts what the chef says. There's obviously going to be an element of "nothing ever seemed wrong" from some of these people. There was already someone to blame - the doctor. People may not have wanted to admit something was amiss and did nothing. MJ said he had 2 nose jobs, why should we believe him when it comes to his diet? I'm not saying we shouldn't believe him. If we are believing everything the chef says, she also said that at one point everything MJ ate was liquidised. I cant see how anyone could deny that the guy had issues with eating. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 12:11:08 GMT
Why would we automatically disregard anything he has to say, just because you found interviews with the chef? Considering he was his trainer, I actually want to read more into what he had to say about his routines towards the end. Three weeks wasn't three years. There's no need to be so dismissive by the way, we are only discussing here. Why wouldn't we? Lou's account doesn't fit the available evidence and that's all that really matters - evidence. To be clear, it's Lou's comment about MJ eating ONCE a day that's being dismissed. Not any training regimen.Autopsy report - not skeletal or emaciated, but a fairly healthy 50 year old man with a robust heart. Zero evidence of anorexia in that. Expert witness - Dr Shafer already provided. Kenny Ortega provided also - issues more psychological than physical which chimes with the autopsy report. And so on. Discussion is one thing, but repeating debunked claims is quite another. In this case, available evidence is all that matters. Speculation is largely irrelevant as are personal feelings about Michael Jackson’s health. That's the reality. What the hell are you on about!? Do you realise we've moved on from the anorexia bit? Or do we have to open a new thread? You're saying there is absolutely no need to look into what MJs fitness program/schedule was like, and that anything Ferrigno has to say can be ignored because his autopsy said he was fine? |
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Post by aazzaabb on Oct 11, 2020 12:11:40 GMT
It isn't even me. But the evidence has always been there disproving various claims. That's the point, isn't it? Claims should always be thrown away once evidence disproves them. It's a quote from 1 interview. Why wouldn't anyone want to know more about what kind of fitness plan or nutrition MJ was on in the weeks/months prior to his death? MJs issues didnt just start in his last 3 weeks. Its just bizarre to say we can completely disregard everything the guy says because it contradicts what the chef says. There's obviously going to be an element of "nothing ever seemed wrong" from some of these people. There was already someone to blame - the doctor. People may not have wanted to admit something was amiss and did nothing. MJ said he had 2 nose jobs, why should we believe him when it comes to his diet? I'm not saying we shouldn't believe him. If we are believing everything the chef says, she also said that at one point everything MJ ate was liquidised. I cant see how anyone could deny that the guy had issues with eating. Well it doesn’t suit PG13’s opinion so..... there you go haha. |
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Post by pg13 on Oct 11, 2020 12:14:50 GMT
It isn't even me. But the evidence has always been there disproving various claims. That's the point, isn't it? Claims should always be thrown away once evidence disproves them. Oh it’s definitely you. You’ve always had to be the authoritative final word on pretty much anything MJ related haven’t you? As you mentioned, Charles, MJCast.... Fans are having a conversation here regarding MJ’s health. Are we supposed to just end the conversation and go home because you post the facts? Essentially you try to shut down the conversation or try to come across as some sort of ultimate authority. People have a need to express themselves without always being jumped on and gaslighted. Incorrect and blatant man playing in lieu of actual discussion or debate. The authoritative evidence here is the autopsy report. Then testimony from those who were there and, finally, medical expert witnesses such as Dr Shafer. You can overlook those, but it's shaky ground to stand on. |
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Post by pg13 on Oct 11, 2020 12:19:27 GMT
Why wouldn't we? Lou's account doesn't fit the available evidence and that's all that really matters - evidence. To be clear, it's Lou's comment about MJ eating ONCE a day that's being dismissed. Not any training regimen.Autopsy report - not skeletal or emaciated, but a fairly healthy 50 year old man with a robust heart. Zero evidence of anorexia in that. Expert witness - Dr Shafer already provided. Kenny Ortega provided also - issues more psychological than physical which chimes with the autopsy report. And so on. Discussion is one thing, but repeating debunked claims is quite another. In this case, available evidence is all that matters. Speculation is largely irrelevant as are personal feelings about Michael Jackson’s health. That's the reality. What the hell are you on about!? Do you realise we've moved on from the anorexia bit? Or do we have to open a new thread? You're saying there is absolutely no need to look into what MJs fitness program/schedule was like, and that anything Ferrigno has to say can be ignored because his autopsy said he was fine? No, it's obviously Lou Ferrigno claiming MJ ate once a day that's disproved and dismissed. As I clearly stated in bold. As Ferrigno repeatedly said to Larry King, Michael Jackson was in very good physical condition. You can read that here: transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0906/29/lkl.01.htmlInteresting bit here: Doesn't chime with his "ate one meal a day" narrative. By the way, Lou talks about Michael's training in that link. You might be surprised at how much it chomes with the autopsy report as far as physical health is concerned. |
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Post by aazzaabb on Oct 11, 2020 12:22:59 GMT
Oh it’s definitely you. You’ve always had to be the authoritative final word on pretty much anything MJ related haven’t you? As you mentioned, Charles, MJCast.... Fans are having a conversation here regarding MJ’s health. Are we supposed to just end the conversation and go home because you post the facts? Essentially you try to shut down the conversation or try to come across as some sort of ultimate authority. People have a need to express themselves without always being jumped on and gaslighted. Incorrect and blatant man playing in lieu of actual discussion or debate. The authoritative evidence here is the autopsy report. Then testimony from those who were there and, finally, medical expert witnesses such as Dr Shafer. You can overlook those, but it's shaky ground to stand on. I mean what am I supposed to even say to you at this point? Fuck off? Something to that effect? And then you trot off somewhere else to say I couldn’t deal with your logic so I ended up blocking you? That’s sort of your thing isn’t it? Or maybe have a bitch about us on your Shit Fans Say thread? I have no personal gripe with you but you definitely have an insecurity about desperately having to disarm the entire fan community and beat them into the ground. Maybe you should address that and just leave people express themselves freely with nuance and tongue in cheek. Again, another thread sort of ruined now ( and I apologise to Russg for that)! Anyways, I agree very much with innuendo’s point. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 12:29:02 GMT
What the hell are you on about!? Do you realise we've moved on from the anorexia bit? Or do we have to open a new thread? You're saying there is absolutely no need to look into what MJs fitness program/schedule was like, and that anything Ferrigno has to say can be ignored because his autopsy said he was fine? No, it's obviously Lou Ferrigno claiming MJ ate once a day that's disproved and dismissed. As I clearly stated in bold. As Ferrigno repeatedly said to Larry King, Michael Jackson was in very good physical condition. You can read that here: transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0906/29/lkl.01.htmlInteresting bit here: Doesn't chime with his "ate one meal a day" narrative. By the way, Lou talks about Michael's training in that link. You might be surprised at how much it chomes with the autopsy report as far as physical health is concerned. Why would you believe Ferrigno in one interview and not another? Not saying I believe one over the other because I haven't read any of this stuff in 10 years. But I plan to later because there is a difference between: Being a healthy 50 year old Being a healthy 50 year old that is due to start a series of 50 concerts in coming weeks. Look at MJ in Brunei 96 the Royal Show. That leotard is pretty tight on him. Hes bigger than he was in 92. Then look at how loose the gold pants are towards the end of 97. He was surely going to lose weight during the series. MJ did not look like. He could afford to lose a gram. I want to look into this more. Not just the autopsy. Anyone hooking up to propofol at night was not healthy enough to face what he was facing at that weight. |
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Post by aazzaabb on Oct 11, 2020 12:31:15 GMT
No, it's obviously Lou Ferrigno claiming MJ ate once a day that's disproved and dismissed. As I clearly stated in bold. As Ferrigno repeatedly said to Larry King, Michael Jackson was in very good physical condition. You can read that here: transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0906/29/lkl.01.htmlInteresting bit here: Doesn't chime with his "ate one meal a day" narrative. By the way, Lou talks about Michael's training in that link. You might be surprised at how much it chomes with the autopsy report as far as physical health is concerned. Why would you believe Ferrigno in one interview and not another? Not saying I believe one over the other because I haven't read any of this stuff in 10 years. But I plan to later because there is a difference between: Being a healthy 50 year old Being a healthy 50 year old that is due to start a series of 50 concerts in coming weeks. Look at MJ in Brunei 96 the Royal Show. That leotard is pretty tight on him. Hes bigger than he was in 92. Then look at how loose the gold pants are towards the end of 97. He was surely going to lose weight during the series. MJ did not look like. He could afford to lose a gram. I want to look into this more. Not just the autopsy. Anyone hooking up to propofol at night was not healthy enough to face what he was facing at that weight. Too fuckin right! Dancing and performing for 2 hours your pretty much going to lose weight every night. MJ looked like he couldn’t afford to lose a pound. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 12:33:54 GMT
Why would you believe Ferrigno in one interview and not another? Not saying I believe one over the other because I haven't read any of this stuff in 10 years. But I plan to later because there is a difference between: Being a healthy 50 year old Being a healthy 50 year old that is due to start a series of 50 concerts in coming weeks. Look at MJ in Brunei 96 the Royal Show. That leotard is pretty tight on him. Hes bigger than he was in 92. Then look at how loose the gold pants are towards the end of 97. He was surely going to lose weight during the series. MJ did not look like. He could afford to lose a gram. I want to look into this more. Not just the autopsy. Anyone hooking up to propofol at night was not healthy enough to face what he was facing at that weight. Too fuckin right! Dancing and performing for 2 hours your pretty much going to lose weight every night. He did an interview where he said how much weight he lost per night, but I cant remember when, nor can I even confirm it was MJ. It would be like someone saying Eluid Kipchoge looks fit enough to race, when in reality he has only been eating a yoghurt and scone for the last 6 weeks. |
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Post by aazzaabb on Oct 11, 2020 12:38:04 GMT
Too fuckin right! Dancing and performing for 2 hours your pretty much going to lose weight every night. He did an interview where he said how much weight he lost per night, but I cant remember when, nor can I even confirm it was MJ. It would be like someone saying Eluid Kipchoge looks fit enough to race, when in reality he has only been eating a yoghurt and scone for the last 6 weeks. I remember seeing an interview with Michael Flatly during Lord of The Dance and (I wish I could remember) but he was losing I believe over a stone or even a few stone per show and had to eat like a horse each night after his concerts to maintain his weight. It was insanely scary the weight he was losing. |
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Post by pg13 on Oct 11, 2020 12:43:30 GMT
No, it's obviously Lou Ferrigno claiming MJ ate once a day that's disproved and dismissed. As I clearly stated in bold. As Ferrigno repeatedly said to Larry King, Michael Jackson was in very good physical condition. You can read that here: transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0906/29/lkl.01.htmlInteresting bit here: Doesn't chime with his "ate one meal a day" narrative. By the way, Lou talks about Michael's training in that link. You might be surprised at how much it chomes with the autopsy report as far as physical health is concerned. Not saying I believe one over the other because I haven't read any of this stuff in 10 years. But I plan to later because there is a difference between: Being a healthy 50 year old Being a healthy 50 year old that is due to start a series of 50 concerts in coming weeks. Look at MJ in Brunei 96 the Royal Show. That leotard is pretty tight on him. Hes bigger than he was in 92. Then look at how loose the gold pants are towards the end of 97. He was surely going to lose weight during the series. MJ did not look like. He could afford to lose a gram. I want to look into this more. Not just the autopsy. Anyone hooking up to propofol at night was not healthy enough to face what he was facing at that weight.That's where you keep going wrong in that it does not seem to register with you that it's Lou's comment about MJ eating ONCE a day that's disproved and dismissed. Now, that's completely separate to what Lou said about how well Michael Jackson trained and how he seemed physically fine to him. The second bolded part - Michael's autopsy was clear.....fairly healthy 50 year old with a robust heart. Something you keep on ignoring. Propofol abuse was clearly linked with Michael's state of mind. Refer back to Kenny Ortega testifying under oath how he believed Michael's problem was more mental than physical. Healthy body. But unhealthy mind. There's the nuance you've been missing each time. That's key to understanding Michael Jackson’s last days. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 11, 2020 12:44:17 GMT
He did an interview where he said how much weight he lost per night, but I cant remember when, nor can I even confirm it was MJ. It would be like someone saying Eluid Kipchoge looks fit enough to race, when in reality he has only been eating a yoghurt and scone for the last 6 weeks. I remember seeing an interview with Michael Flatly during Lord of The Dance and (I wish I could remember) but he was losing I believe over a stone or even a few stone per show and had to eat like a horse each night after his concerts to maintain his weight. It was insanely scary the weight he was losing. Yeah I read that one too. I know how much I lose per distance when I run. Thats why my interest is with Ferrigno now. I'll catch up on it later. I've just read that MJ was getting nutritional supplenets intravenously up to March 09. The other chef said most of his food was liquidised. Autopsy says one thing, but this guy had a serious problem with eating and food. |
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