TonyR
The Legend Continues
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Post by TonyR on Sept 14, 2022 19:13:59 GMT
The King Charles vs Pens stuff isn't really helping any arguments about the Royal Family and a disconnect to the common man. He is still grieving though I guess, but he's not off to a great start with the Tik Tok generation. It is hard not to think of the obscene cost of everything to do with the funeral etc. at such a sensitive time for people money wise though. I'd imagine when the dust settles there will be some form of backlash. Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 19:29:35 GMT
The King Charles vs Pens stuff isn't really helping any arguments about the Royal Family and a disconnect to the common man. He is still grieving though I guess, but he's not off to a great start with the Tik Tok generation. It is hard not to think of the obscene cost of everything to do with the funeral etc. at such a sensitive time for people money wise though. I'd imagine when the dust settles there will be some form of backlash. Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? True. Again, this is from an outsiders perspective is all. |
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,489
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Post by TonyR on Sept 14, 2022 19:44:38 GMT
Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? True. Again, this is from an outsiders perspective is all. Yeah well stick to your potatoes and Boyzone. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 21:36:42 GMT
True. Again, this is from an outsiders perspective is all. Yeah well stick to your potatoes and Boyzone. |
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,489
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Post by TonyR on Sept 15, 2022 5:22:08 GMT
Yeah well stick to your potatoes and Boyzone. Thanks for waiting until after the funeral. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2022 8:13:56 GMT
Alexa, set a reminder for Tuesday to insult Tony please Thanks for waiting until after the funeral. C u next Tuesday 😊 |
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Post by pg13 on Sept 15, 2022 12:04:18 GMT
Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? True. Again, this is from an outsiders perspective is all. Outsider? You do realise that Irish people are NOT regarded as foreigners by the UK Government, right? It's literally stated so in our uncodified constitution from 1949! It's literally why the Common Travel Area was created. British is an umbrella term that encompasses the British Isles in much the same way American encompasses the entire continent of America (North and South). The argument you’re raising is essentially saying money should not be spent on any huge event until poverty is eradicated. No Government events such as UK State Funerals or Republic of Ireland's Easter Rising commemorations. No sports events such as Premier League or GAA. No music events - imagine No MJ concert in London or Dublin?! Basically, it's an argument reliant upon the False Dilemma Fallacy and is an error in logic. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 15, 2022 13:26:19 GMT
True. Again, this is from an outsiders perspective is all. Outsider? You do realise that Irish people are NOT regarded as foreigners by the UK Government, right? It's literally stated so in our uncodified constitution from 1949! It's literally why the Common Travel Area was created. British is an umbrella term that encompasses the British Isles in much the same way American encompasses the entire continent of America (North and South). The argument you’re raising is essentially saying money should not be spent on any huge event until poverty is eradicated. No Government events such as UK State Funerals or Republic of Ireland's Easter Rising commemorations. No sports events such as Premier League or GAA. No music events - imagine No MJ concert in London or Dublin?! Basically, it's an argument reliant upon the False Dilemma Fallacy and is an error in logic. I was asking an honest question to British people here because 2 english friends of mine (1 a royalist, the other not too fussed either way) had said it me about the cost, I was not trying to start anything . I said "outsider" because the Queen and the Royal Family mean absolutely nothing to me as an Irish person (and all the pageantry is absolutely alien to us). I happened to be fascinated by what's going on and just had some questions. I didn't mean to offend you (or anyone else) so I won't be posting about this any more here. |
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Sept 15, 2022 16:24:50 GMT
The King Charles vs Pens stuff isn't really helping any arguments about the Royal Family and a disconnect to the common man. He is still grieving though I guess, but he's not off to a great start with the Tik Tok generation. It is hard not to think of the obscene cost of everything to do with the funeral etc. at such a sensitive time for people money wise though. I'd imagine when the dust settles there will be some form of backlash. Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? I don't really think the whole "look how much these things cost" argument negates any questions or concerns about how much money is being spent on this tbh, just seems like a way to hand wave away said concerns and act like this amount of money should be spent on it. Which is something that is up for heavy debate depending on your viewpoints on the royal family and their general deserving of the things they have and the treatment they get. |
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,489
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Post by TonyR on Sept 15, 2022 16:32:24 GMT
Don't really get the point. How much does the Olympics cost? The World Cup? The Premier League? That new Lord of The Rings series? 500 million? I don't really think the whole "look how much these things cost" argument negates any questions or concerns about how much money is being spent on this tbh, just seems like a way to hand wave away said concerns and act like this amount of money should be spent on it. Which is something that is up for heavy debate depending on your viewpoints on the royal family and their general deserving of the things they have and the treatment they get. The point is that it's all subjective. Some things cost a lot of money. Is the burial of a Queen of 70 years worth more or less than paying 200 million quid for a FOOTBALLER. Or staging the Olympics or a Netflix TV series. It doesn't matter that you agree with it or not. Like pg13 says, do we never spend money on any thing until poverty is eliminated (i.e. never). You can see from the public reaction and turnout that the spend is in the public interest. And the money that is spent on the monarchy is more than outweighed by what they bring in in terms of tourism. I understand why some may look down on the so called privileged, but I'm not convinced it's a privileged lifestyle. Like MJ, I'm not sure I would have swapped places with someone who had every move and word scrutinised. Especially if I was born into that lifestyle and had no choice. |
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Sept 15, 2022 16:43:18 GMT
I don't really think the whole "look how much these things cost" argument negates any questions or concerns about how much money is being spent on this tbh, just seems like a way to hand wave away said concerns and act like this amount of money should be spent on it. Which is something that is up for heavy debate depending on your viewpoints on the royal family and their general deserving of the things they have and the treatment they get. The point is that it's all subjective. Some things cost a lot of money. Is the burial of a Queen of 70 years worth more or less than paying 200 million quid for a FOOTBALLER. Or staging the Olympics or a Netflix TV series. It doesn't matter that you agree with it or not. Like pg13 says, do we never spend money on any thing until poverty is eliminated (i.e. never). You can see from the public reaction and turnout that the spend is in the public interest. And the money that is spent on the monarchy is more than outweighed by what they bring in in terms of tourism. I understand why some may look down on the so called privileged, but I'm not convinced it's a privileged lifestyle. Like MJ, I'm not sure I would have swapped places with someone who had every move and word scrutinised. Especially if I was born into that lifestyle and had no choice. Nobody has said we should stop spending money. This is just more hand waving of concerns by responding to points nobody made. I do think it's valid to a feel a certain way about so much money being spent on this during the current times, and it's not really an issue to be dismissed because money is spent on other things. I don't think comparing money being spent on the monarchy to buying a footballer is really a valid comparison at all. Very surface level argument when it comes to the issues of money being spent when it comes to the royals. Unlikely to agree with most people here as I do not hold the same opinions of the monarchy most here seem to. I'll probably check out of convos about them on here now as it really isn't productive. |
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TonyR
The Legend Continues
Posts: 8,489
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Post by TonyR on Sept 15, 2022 17:09:25 GMT
The point is that it's all subjective. Some things cost a lot of money. Is the burial of a Queen of 70 years worth more or less than paying 200 million quid for a FOOTBALLER. Or staging the Olympics or a Netflix TV series. It doesn't matter that you agree with it or not. Like pg13 says, do we never spend money on any thing until poverty is eliminated (i.e. never). You can see from the public reaction and turnout that the spend is in the public interest. And the money that is spent on the monarchy is more than outweighed by what they bring in in terms of tourism. I understand why some may look down on the so called privileged, but I'm not convinced it's a privileged lifestyle. Like MJ, I'm not sure I would have swapped places with someone who had every move and word scrutinised. Especially if I was born into that lifestyle and had no choice. Nobody has said we should stop spending money. This is just more hand waving of concerns by responding to points nobody made. I do think it's valid to a feel a certain way about so much money being spent on this during the current times, and it's not really an issue to be dismissed because money is spent on other things. I don't think comparing money being spent on the monarchy to buying a footballer is really a valid comparison at all. Very surface level argument when it comes to the issues of money being spent when it comes to the royals. Unlikely to agree with most people here as I do not hold the same opinions of the monarchy most here seem to. I'll probably check out of convos about them on here now as it really isn't productive. You give one point of view. I calmly give another. You bow out. How do normal conversations go with you? I fully get other people's opinion on this. I was just answering Innuendo's point on a lot of money being spent and is it worth it? |
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Post by pg13 on Sept 15, 2022 17:55:41 GMT
Outsider? You do realise that Irish people are NOT regarded as foreigners by the UK Government, right? It's literally stated so in our uncodified constitution from 1949! It's literally why the Common Travel Area was created. British is an umbrella term that encompasses the British Isles in much the same way American encompasses the entire continent of America (North and South). The argument you’re raising is essentially saying money should not be spent on any huge event until poverty is eradicated. No Government events such as UK State Funerals or Republic of Ireland's Easter Rising commemorations. No sports events such as Premier League or GAA. No music events - imagine No MJ concert in London or Dublin?! Basically, it's an argument reliant upon the False Dilemma Fallacy and is an error in logic. I was asking an honest question to British people here because 2 english friends of mine (1 a royalist, the other not too fussed either way) had said it me about the cost, I was not trying to start anything . I said "outsider" because the Queen and the Royal Family mean absolutely nothing to me as an Irish person (and all the pageantry is absolutely alien to us). I happened to be fascinated by what's going on and just had some questions. I didn't mean to offend you (or anyone else) so I won't be posting about this any more here. Firstly, let me assure you that at no point wS I feeling offended. Not a bit. But I do enjoy discussion and debate. It usually helps sharpen one's thinking and to be clearer about something. It'll take considerably more than that to offend me anyway. Secondly, the Republic of Ireland has a population of nearly 5 million people. A lot of them DO like the Royal Family and enjoy the spectacle of British pageantry. You might find it alien on a personal level, but a good many ROI citizens don't feel that way. But I don't see any real need for you to define yourself as an outsider in terms of this discussion or otherwise. The people of the Republic of Ireland are very much part of the ancestry of the people here. That is indisputed. If you have any further questions, fire away! |
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Post by SmoothGangsta on Sept 15, 2022 18:05:32 GMT
Nobody has said we should stop spending money. This is just more hand waving of concerns by responding to points nobody made. I do think it's valid to a feel a certain way about so much money being spent on this during the current times, and it's not really an issue to be dismissed because money is spent on other things. I don't think comparing money being spent on the monarchy to buying a footballer is really a valid comparison at all. Very surface level argument when it comes to the issues of money being spent when it comes to the royals. Unlikely to agree with most people here as I do not hold the same opinions of the monarchy most here seem to. I'll probably check out of convos about them on here now as it really isn't productive. You give one point of view. I calmly give another. You bow out. How do normal conversations go with you? I fully get other people's opinion on this. I was just answering Innuendo's point on a lot of money being spent and is it worth it? ?? I responded to everything you said. |
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Post by pg13 on Sept 15, 2022 18:08:19 GMT
The point is that it's all subjective. Some things cost a lot of money. Is the burial of a Queen of 70 years worth more or less than paying 200 million quid for a FOOTBALLER. Or staging the Olympics or a Netflix TV series. It doesn't matter that you agree with it or not. Like pg13 says, do we never spend money on any thing until poverty is eliminated (i.e. never). You can see from the public reaction and turnout that the spend is in the public interest. And the money that is spent on the monarchy is more than outweighed by what they bring in in terms of tourism. I understand why some may look down on the so called privileged, but I'm not convinced it's a privileged lifestyle. Like MJ, I'm not sure I would have swapped places with someone who had every move and word scrutinised. Especially if I was born into that lifestyle and had no choice. Nobody has said we should stop spending money. This is just more hand waving of concerns by responding to points nobody made. I do think it's valid to a feel a certain way about so much money being spent on this during the current times, and it's not really an issue to be dismissed because money is spent on other things. I don't think comparing money being spent on the monarchy to buying a footballer is really a valid comparison at all. Very surface level argument when it comes to the issues of money being spent when it comes to the royals. Unlikely to agree with most people here as I do not hold the same opinions of the monarchy most here seem to. I'll probably check out of convos about them on here now as it really isn't productive. On the contrary, a generalised wide open statement was made vis a vis the cost of living which opened the door to pointing out various forms of obscene spending. Both Governmental and non-Governmental spending. If its obscene for the UK Government to spend millions on the Queen's State Funeral, then the same holds true for all non-UK Government spending. Governments do not stop spending huge sums on various events because some citizens are struggling financially. Non-government spending isn't conditional on people struggling financially either. Given that poverty has always existed in Human History, when do you propose it's OK for Governments and organisations to spend "obscene" amounts of money? Thats a serious question. This is not an either/or situation = False Dilemma Fallacy. Both things can be done at once. In fact, the UK Government has long had a plan in place for the Queen's State Funeral. Meaning money has not been siphoned off from a budget for education, health and so on to pay for it. So, both things can be done concurrently. Government finances does not really work like a household even though many think it does. |
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