|
Post by respect77 on Oct 13, 2023 8:46:23 GMT
It feels like the 1930s all over again... Unreal. "Never Again" is forgotten in only 80 years.
|
|
|
Post by respect77 on Oct 13, 2023 9:59:49 GMT
|
|
|
Post by respect77 on Oct 13, 2023 12:22:00 GMT
So now Hamas is blaming the atrocities on Gazan civilians.
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 12:47:56 GMT
Sage Despatches is a Northern Ireland terrorism, security and counter-terrorism expert. His knowledge is gained from real life in his professional role back home.
Sage is anonymous because PIRA and other Republicans would still kill him.
He's right that Irish PM Varadkar and anyone else who doesn't have a valid, practical alternative should step away.
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 12:56:18 GMT
I've never seen such blatant terrorism glorification in so many countries in life!
Not even PIRA, ETA, FARC, ANC/MK and ISIS were celebrated so widely by far too many. Anti-semitism is real.
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 13:26:57 GMT
|
|
|
Post by respect77 on Oct 13, 2023 14:07:06 GMT
Great interview. The West really needs to stop the constant lecturing of Israel while they are under existential threat.
|
|
|
Post by respect77 on Oct 13, 2023 14:14:06 GMT
Sage Despatches is a Northern Ireland terrorism, security and counter-terrorism expert. His knowledge is gained from real life in his professional role back home. Sage is anonymous because PIRA and other Republicans would still kill him. He's right that Irish PM Varadkar and anyone else who doesn't have a valid, practical alternative should step away.
It's always Israel who should play nicely. Always them. Never the other side. Gaza and the Palestinian territories get the highest amount of foreign aid per capita, yet they still didn't manage to build their own electricity, water etc for the 16 years since they are in power in Gaza? There is no obligation for any country to provide supplies to its enemy during a war. That Israel is demanded that they do is actually pretty absurd. Why didn't this bleeding heart international community demand Hamas to spend their donation on building infrastructure for the people, rather than building a terror infrastructure? I am sorry, but the West very much carries a responsibility in how things got to this point. The constant turning away from what Hamas is actually doing with their money, instead of what they should have. Also blockades during sieges were pretty much a part of every war in human history.
BTW:
|
|
|
Post by LindavG on Oct 13, 2023 15:45:19 GMT
This is an excellent documentary on the history of the Israel-Palestine conflict:
I also recommend this DW documentary to understand the impact of this conflict on a more relatable human level:
It is such a complicated situation. There are arguments to be made for (and against) both sides of the conflict. Hamas is a terrorist organisation and their attacks on innocent Israeli civilians are abhorrant. They're not helping the Palestinian cause whatsoever. Israel's retaliation on innocent civilians in Gaza is also horrifying. The people of Gaza already live in incredibly difficult oppressive circumstances. Gaza has a population of 2.4 million on a strip of land the size of Detroit or Philadelphia. The average age of the population is only 18 years old. Now Israel has blocked them off from food and water, electricity and fuel and ordered more than a million people in Northern Gaza to move to the South, knowing full well these people have nowhere to go. It's an orchestrated humanitarian disaster.
I have deep empathy for all innocent Palestinians and Israelis caught up in this senseless never-ending war.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2023 17:23:17 GMT
Imagine people supporting and lauding Omagh the way so many are what happened last Saturday.
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 18:46:39 GMT
90 mins ago in a debate about resolving the conflict, I had a delusional response from someone:
This was a adult - not a teenager!
Aye....hug the nearest Jihadi terrorist and all will be sunshine & rainbows! 🤣
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 19:09:53 GMT
Hamas need a better propaganda department...🤦♂️
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 22:29:23 GMT
Hamas is a completely different kind of terrorist group - they're a fully 21st Century evolution known as a Hybrid Threat. Hamas is thought to have up to 40,000 fighters. PIRA never had anywhere near that many.
The same counter-terrorist strategies used against PIRA and ETA et al will simply not work. Hamas are far too powerful for that.
As NATO StratCom COE report stated,
"The strategic logic of human shields has two components. It is based on an awareness of Israel’s desire to minimise collateral damage, and of Western public opinion’s sensitivity towards civilian casualties. If the IDF uses lethal force and causes an increase in civilian casualties, Hamas can utilise that as a lawfare tool: it can accuse Israel of committing war crimes, which could result in the imposition of a wide array of sanctions.
Alternatively, if the IDF limits its use of military force in Gaza to avoid collateral damage, Hamas will be less susceptible to Israeli attacks, and thereby able to protect its assets while continuing to fight."
From my perspective, it is Hamas who are not interested in peace which isn't possible whilst they are heavily armed plus all too willing to murder.
The Israelis are between a rock and a hard place. Peace is desired, but can never be secured with a group like Hamas so they would have to be defeated somehow first.
|
|
|
Post by pg13 on Oct 13, 2023 23:52:49 GMT
Egypt absolutely does NOT want Gazans inside their borders for at least three reasons. 1) They don't want Gazans using their territory to attack Israel from. 2) Egypt don't want more refugees. 3) Egyptian President Abdel Fattah el-Sissi said, “The threat there is significant because it means the liquidation of this (Palestinian) cause. It’s important for its people to stay steadfast and exist on its land.” Egypt actively WANTS Gazans to stay in Gaza. This is from Reuters: "Security in the area around Rafah is also of concern to Egypt because Sinai has been the site of an Islamist insurgency that flared a decade ago. Hamas, which has run the Gaza Strip since 2007, shares the Islamist ideology of the Muslim Brotherhood, a movement outlawed in Egypt." www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/bombardments-hit-area-gaza-sinai-border-crossing-gaza-officials-2023-10-10/Egypt DOESN'T want or need Hamas sneaking in and linking up with Muslim Brotherhood. From a National Security perspective, it's far better for Egypt to keep their border shut to keep Hamas away from Muslim Brotherhood. It makes sense.
|
|
|
Post by LindavG on Oct 14, 2023 1:46:48 GMT
Hamas need a better propaganda department...🤦♂️ There has been a lot of misinformation and unverified claims on both sides these past few days. There is also no evidence of Hamas beheading babies even though everyone keeps repeating this, though they've committed other atrocities of course. Regarding Hamas' supposed power, they are not an existential threat to Israel at all. For every Israeli killed, Israel kills 10 more Palestinians. Israel has one of the most powerful armies in the entire world, with the full backing of the United States. Just read the stats on how many Palestinians are injured and killed in Israeli attacks and vice versa, there is a massive gap. To compare the situation in Palestine to Ireland or Spain is ridiculous. We are talking about millions of people who were forced out of their homes and driven to live on a tiny piece of land, locked in on all sides and fully dependent on their occupier for humanitarian aid to survive. These people are living in abject poverty with no hope for improvement and almost no way to get out. It is rightfully described as an open-air prison. Of course that doesn't justify violence against Israelis (especially not innocent civilians) but I'm seeing no nuance or effort to understand the other side in this discussion at all. And finally regarding Egypt or other Arab nations not taking in Palestinian refugees en masse, this is often mentioned as a 'gotcha' against them but I can see why they don't believe this will help Palestine in the long term. The moment Palestinians leave Palestine to settle somewhere else, Israel will take over those territories and colonise them just as they have done before when Palestinians were forced to flee. And then the hope for a Palestinian state will be truly lost. This is also why Hamas urges Palestinians to stay in their homes despite Israel's threats. Well that, and the fact that they can use Palestinian casualties for political gain.
|
|